IRC log of fenfire on 2005-04-09

Timestamps are in UTC.

07:27:39 [majukati]
it's not nice that installation stops to floating point error or segmentation fault
07:44:44 [rubberpaw]
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08:14:37 [rubberpaw]
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09:04:41 [tuukkah]
benja_, we forgot to try an ad-hoc irc server yesterday :-)
09:11:21 [majukati]
09:21:51 [rubberpaw]
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09:32:24 [tuukkah]
we had an ad-hoc wireless network, but we only used it for supertux
10:25:59 [rubberpaw]
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10:34:31 [tuukkah]
antont, I read from the news that Oulu is getting a wlan network. but about price they said something like "free use will be free and you have to pay for pay-services"
10:44:14 [vegai]
nice piece of art:
10:52:40 [majukati]
tseh, i used classpath's MemoryImageSource - then there's nothing to see =)
10:54:39 [tuukkah]
oh, was it java? I thought javascript
11:02:47 [tuukkah]
would it be a good idea to add a darcs test that tries to compile before darcs push?
11:04:43 [tuukkah]
oh, this time it was only my problem: I had made a comment inside a region that was commented in a patch I built. and you can't nest comments in Java :-/
11:13:06 [majukati]
oh, now it seems to work
11:13:11 [majukati]
12:48:23 [tuukkah]
majukati, so you're having luck with ImageVob?
12:56:55 [rubberpaw]
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13:19:54 [majukati]
13:20:13 [tuukkah]
nice :-)
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14:26:12 [rubberpaw]
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15:06:07 [benja_]
15:06:24 [benja_]
anybody here?
15:07:11 [majukati]
15:07:19 [benja_]
hei :)
15:07:57 [majukati]
i fell stupid of trying to use wrong class for the image thing :/
15:08:03 [majukati]
15:08:05 [benja_]
15:08:34 [benja_]
I'm unhappy that I cannot do my studies faster
15:08:42 [benja_]
I mean, that reading takes so long
15:08:53 [tuukkah]
15:10:18 [benja_]
* benja_ is at agora atm
15:10:35 [ffdarcsbot]
libvob: Benja Fallenstein <>, add NoGrowLob to Lobs; support non-clipped Components.frame()s
15:10:36 [benja_]
majukati: I tried to be less of a zombie today but you weren't at Wilhelmiina as far as I could tell ;)
15:10:42 [ffdarcsbot]
libvob: Benja Fallenstein <>, fix ClipLob.mouse()
15:10:50 [ffdarcsbot]
libvob: Benja Fallenstein <>, sanity check
15:10:59 [majukati]
benja_: we ate at home because of it was raining
15:11:21 [benja_]
ok :)
15:11:43 [benja_]
how's the appartment coming along?
15:12:13 [majukati]
well, we have the internet already.. :)
15:12:18 [benja_]
15:12:25 [benja_]
still many boxes?
15:12:49 [majukati]
15:13:26 [ibid]
good evening :)
15:13:42 [benja_]
good :)
15:13:45 [benja_]
ibid: hei
15:13:47 [ibid]
15:13:51 [ibid]
15:14:02 [ibid]
i sense a plan to do away with my head
15:14:07 [ibid]
("pääni menoksi":)
15:14:39 [rubberpaw]
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15:14:43 [ffdarcsbot]
fenfire: Benja Fallenstein <>, put a frame around the view-changing sidebar again; don't stretch the views
15:14:48 [ffdarcsbot]
fenfire: Benja Fallenstein <>, factor out view changing box into different class; fix it
15:14:58 [benja_]
ibid: it's good that Matti and Heidi have unpacked their boxes
15:15:04 [ibid]
15:15:51 [majukati]
the store is not that good since it's long but narrow. so we don't have a certain algorith for getting stuff out of there except "take all out to corridor to take one thing out"
15:20:51 [benja_]
15:23:01 [vegai]
is it like tetris or like hanoi's tower?
15:25:02 [ibid]
if the priests complete hanoi's tower, the world ends
15:26:00 [tuukkah]
pushed small updates to I wonder if I should remove references to kaffe, as it doesn't work anymore :-/
15:29:23 [benja_]
tuukkah: why?
15:29:29 [benja_]
(doesn't it)
15:31:35 [tuukkah]
although I have same kind of problems with sablevm. crashes, freezes and endless loops all the time
15:33:37 [benja_]
tuukkah, why doesn't kaffe work?
15:34:12 [tuukkah]
now why, that's a good question...
15:34:20 [benja_]
what's the symptom?
15:34:33 [tuukkah]
crashes, freezes and endless loops all the time
15:34:47 [benja_]
ah, "same kind of problems'
15:34:56 [benja_]
are they at the same places?
15:35:31 [tuukkah]
every place, I'd say
15:35:44 [benja_]
huh, weird
15:35:49 [benja_]
have you tried non-FF programs?
15:35:57 [tuukkah]
15:56:52 [tuukkah]
anyway, Sun's never has these problems
15:58:11 [benja_]
let's say it has them less often
15:58:25 [benja_]
I have seen crashes in Sun's VM that were not related to native code
16:05:09 [tuukkah]
if I can see somewhere when I've upgraded kaffe packages I should
16:26:21 [rubberpaw]
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17:04:36 [majukati]
1024x2048 is not enough to read but 256x512 seems to be enough for buoys
17:07:52 [benja_]
you mean in images?
17:08:02 [majukati]
for a one a4 page
17:08:17 [benja_]
shouldn't the buoys be zoomed in so that they're readable?
17:08:35 [benja_]
or do you mean the buoys showing the whole article...
17:08:44 [majukati]
17:08:59 [benja_]
btw, I'm very happy that you're working on FenPDF :-)
17:09:15 [majukati]
17:09:18 [benja_]
I'd like to use it but don't want to spend much time on implementing it
17:09:24 [majukati]
17:09:53 [benja_]
it would be nice for learning for the exam -- will not be finished in time, but perhaps in time for the next one :-)
17:10:22 [majukati]
heh, yes
17:11:08 [benja_]
(since my uni puts the learning materials online as pdfs)
17:11:33 [benja_]
I've been working on putting back a tree of properties, like Loom had earlier
17:11:40 [benja_]
but specified in RDF, this time
17:11:50 [benja_]
need to debug more later, going home now
17:11:58 [benja_]
(actually not now but soon :-)
17:12:12 [benja_]
* benja_ is tired of sitting in Agora all day, need some fresh air
17:19:39 [benja_]
going now, cu
17:19:47 [majukati]
17:22:05 [rubberpaw]
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18:19:59 [benja_]
18:20:13 [benja_]
huh, a whole hour? =-]
18:26:30 [rubberpaw]
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18:37:15 [tuukkah]
benja_, you took a long walk or what?
18:37:25 [benja_]
yeah, apparently =)
18:37:44 [benja_]
went home on one of my usual paths, but not the shortest one
18:38:00 [tuukkah]
we went to sauna for an hour and now we're making pizza. it seems when you eat pizza you might as well eat pizza the next day too
18:38:09 [benja_]
18:38:24 [benja_]
* benja_ is eating pasta
18:38:39 [ibid]
* ibid should put the chicken parts in the oven
18:38:42 [tuukkah]
pasta, pizza, pasta, pizza... :-)
18:38:53 [tuukkah]
late dinners :-)
18:39:13 [benja_]
18:39:44 [tuukkah]
benja_, we're using pasta sauce from tuesday or wednesday on the pizza ;-)
18:39:45 [benja_]
but home-made pizza is different from pizza place pizza, of course
19:05:28 [tuukkah]
we didn't have enough cheese left so it definitely is different :-)
19:05:40 [benja_]
ouch =)
19:05:53 [tuukkah]
less fat :-)
19:06:30 [tuukkah]
unless sun-dried tomatos in oil are taken into account
19:07:25 [tuukkah]
oops, toma-toes
19:07:36 [benja_]
what's a toma?
19:07:48 [benja_]
is it like coma-tose?
19:08:22 [tuukkah]
I don't know, but at least it's related to tomes
19:08:30 [benja_]
19:21:53 [rubberpaw]
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20:29:57 [tuukkah]
hmm, the memory requirement has grown because I can't use structureview with the default heap size anymore
20:30:32 [benja_]
tuukkah: you should run the heap profiler and figure out what's taking the memory
20:31:02 [benja_]
what dataset are you using?
20:31:33 [tuukkah]
I was more like thinking how to change the Makefile so that even if I specify JAVA=kaffe the -mx512M part will still get included ;-)
20:31:56 [tuukkah]
20:32:01 [benja_]
20:32:12 [benja_]
that shouldn't need 512M :_)
20:32:13 [tuukkah]
but happens after a while with demo.turtle too
20:32:27 [tuukkah]
I don't know what the default is, 64M?
20:33:14 [benja_]
something like that, I think
20:33:58 [benja_]
perhaps we should implement BFS soon =)
20:34:09 [benja_]
(note that I haven't profiled, so that's just a guess)
20:38:12 [rubberpaw]
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20:38:50 [tuukkah]
mm, I got it running with -mx256M
20:39:14 [tuukkah]
looks like maxring and maxdepth aren't honoured anymore
20:39:44 [benja_]
I wouldn't know what would have broken them, if they aren't
20:40:12 [tuukkah]
i'll try then
20:42:11 [tuukkah]
oh, they work fine
20:42:14 [benja_]
20:42:28 [tuukkah]
I've just made them lower before
22:37:57 [benja_]
tuukkah, btw, according to wikipedia, the Greater Helsinki area "has a population of 975,000 to 1.3 million" depending on the boundaries you draw
22:38:57 [benja_]
22:41:33 [benja_]
the urban area has about one million inhabitants
22:41:38 [benja_]
22:42:31 [benja_]
it's the second fastest growing urban area of the EU (same page)
22:42:49 [vegai]
auch ;/
22:42:50 [benja_]
and almost tied for first place with Toulouse, France
22:42:58 [vegai]
that can't be good, can it?
22:43:28 [benja_]
uh, 'good' or 'bad' seem a bit too simple terms for a phenomenon like that ;)
22:44:13 [vegai]
it clearly implies a trend that the other areas are diminishing
22:44:24 [benja_]
vegai: I don't think so
22:44:30 [vegai]
or possibly that Helsinki-dwellers are very fertile, but I don't think that is it
22:44:34 [benja_]
I think that it's the small areas that lose
22:44:46 [benja_]
look at the number of building projects in Jyvaskyla
22:45:23 [benja_]
i.e., I think that it's country -> city, not other cities -> helsinki
22:45:33 [vegai]
hmm, according to wikipedia, the number of violent crimes in JKL is higher than the average in Finland
22:45:52 [vegai]
yes, of course
22:45:56 [vegai]
I'm worried about the countryside
22:46:01 [benja_]
22:46:13 [benja_]
does it lose from having less people? ;-)
22:46:47 [vegai]
I fear it vanishes from having less people
22:46:49 [benja_]
jyvaskyla population is "ranked 9st"
22:47:00 [vegai]
but JKL isn't exactly countryside anymore
22:47:06 [vegai]
(whatever the folks down south think ;)
22:47:06 [benja_]
certainly not
22:50:30 [vegai]
on the other hand, I don't think that the natural order of things needs to meddled with much
22:50:49 [vegai]
and it seems that the natural order of things currently is that people move to the central areas
22:51:06 [benja_]
22:51:17 [benja_]
the more interesting phenomenon is the degree, here
22:51:24 [benja_]
(here being Finland)
22:51:43 [vegai]
can you elaborate?
22:52:18 [benja_]
well, I think it influences the types of housing built, for example
22:52:33 [benja_]
and it's really noticeable that you see new big houses being built everywhere
22:53:13 [benja_]
I mean, Germany has the country -> city trend too AFAIK, like the whole world has, but you can *see* it in Finland
22:53:24 [vegai]
22:53:35 [vegai]
that's probably because we're always late, so we're in a hurry to catch up
22:54:37 [vegai]
I happen to know that many of the large buildings recently built may end up empty
22:54:46 [benja_]
22:54:47 [vegai]
or that the prices of the flats are going down sharply
22:55:09 [vegai]
I just bought a new home, and the topic came up with my realtor
22:55:14 [benja_]
22:55:34 [vegai]
so it seems they're actually building bit too fast
22:55:43 [benja_]